RNG profit vs Live Casino profit

**yana.marinova** · 24 April 2017, 3:38 am

Hi GPWA members,
I know that most casino affiliates offer both casino and live casino content to your audience (and brands normally offer both anyway). I'm interested to hear how the two products can be compared in terms of % profit (total commission).

**Triple7** · 24 April 2017, 6:15 am

No idea, most of the brands don't show that detailed stats. I am happy already if I can see the deposits, gross game revenue, deductions and something of retention in the stats.

**Scampi** · 24 April 2017, 7:33 am

I believe live dealers have a higher player retention.

**Roulette Zeitung** · 24 April 2017, 11:03 am

Originally Posted by Scampi

I believe live dealers have a higher player retention.

Yes, there is a reason for it.
More and more players know, that there is a simple difference between RNG and live dealer:

On the contrary to the outcome of live dealers' spins or cards, which have a real probability that is valid for all players who are involved, the odds of a RNG are fixed and personalized, like a dark shadow over a single player's head and as a result a RNG has nothing to do with the true randdomness of live dealers.

Leopold

**eenzoo** · 24 April 2017, 12:50 pm

I could be wrong, but you run different accounts here and as a (maybe former) AM of 18bet.com you should have some proper numbers?!

**WagerJoint** · 24 April 2017, 1:36 pm

Without drilling into any database for stats, I would say the player value of live casino players is significantly higher than rng players. Just a guess but I would say they lose 2 to 5 times more than a slots player. To really get an accurate picture of this one would have to also consider the medium and mode values because the value of slot players tends to be driven up by giant whales whereas live players will more frequently have a higher value.

With live blackjack the RTP is much higher but volatility is much lower and most live blackjack players wager around $100 per bet and usually make use of a martingale variation whereas slots players wager maybe $2 per bet. So even in spite of the higher rtp the live blackjack players lose more.

I am not sure about retention because this is highly variable from one player to the next, but I would say the more a player loses the more likely they are to exclude themselves or set limits. So it seems live casino players should have poorer retention. But I don't think our stats prove this. Perhaps on average they have a higher disposable income and are less likely to feel cheated and this is the reason for better than expected retention.

**ocreditor** · 25 April 2017, 4:12 am

I believe Live Dealers have higher value and retention as well

**yana.marinova** · 25 April 2017, 6:19 am

Originally Posted by eenzoo

I could be wrong, but you run different accounts here and as a (maybe former) AM of 18bet.com you should have some proper numbers?!

Hey eenzoo,
Yep, you're right. I had Jim close my account associated with 18bet last year, when I stopped working for the company.
I just wanted to get some overall opinions here comparing the other two verticals as the main focus for me for a long time were sports bettors (a good percentage of whom played roulette) and I don't have data to wrap my head around, just some logical assumptions.

**yana.marinova** · 25 April 2017, 6:25 am

Originally Posted by WagerJoint

Without drilling into any database for stats, I would say the player value of live casino players is significantly higher than rng players. Just a guess but I would say they lose 2 to 5 times more than a slots player. To really get an accurate picture of this one would have to also consider the medium and mode values because the value of slot players tends to be driven up by giant whales whereas live players will more frequently have a higher value.

With live blackjack the RTP is much higher but volatility is much lower and most live blackjack players wager around $100 per bet and usually make use of a martingale variation whereas slots players wager maybe $2 per bet. So even in spite of the higher rtp the live blackjack players lose more.

I am not sure about retention because this is highly variable from one player to the next, but I would say the more a player loses the more likely they are to exclude themselves or set limits. So it seems live casino players should have poorer retention. But I don't think our stats prove this. Perhaps on average they have a higher disposable income and are less likely to feel cheated and this is the reason for better than expected retention.

Thanks a lot Kristie, much appreciated!

**MichaelCorfman** · 26 April 2017, 2:38 pm

I've added a poll to the thread, since it is in the polls forum.

Michael

**sweetbet** · 26 April 2017, 6:35 pm

Live dealer casinos bring online players as close to a brick and mortar casino experience as they can get. I've always found them to be quite popular.

View Poll Results: Are Live Dealer or RNG Casino Players More Valuable?

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