CasinoClicks turning visitors into players

**ardodd** · 8 August 2016, 6:41 am

CasinoClicks turning visitors into players

CasinoClicks is a PTC (Paid-to-Click) website that was started on the concept of helping users earn the money to play on the online casinos platforms. One of the key parts for developing a PTC is to not just give away Bonus Money anymore, but as a way for the users to Earn it along the way. As part of my study in deciding to start a PTC was that some many times a player is promised a signup bonus.

Why New Players want Signup Bonuses?
No out of pocket expense for them is the biggest factor. Along with Free Spins programs, that are really high on some to get them to come in the casino. But as with almost any FREE Program it eventually fails to produce real and consistent players that will invest into the casino. Be it may the Free Spins and Signup Bonuses is what has brought the Online Casino Industry this far and surely will continue to bring even more players into the Online Casino Industry.

What Benefits does using a PTC have?
The biggest benefit that using a PTC would have on the Casinos is not having to give out such big bonuses to get players in. Face it how well is that working out for some casinos? When a casino gives out such big bonuses one of two things have to happen. One the house odds has to increase to cover the potential loses or the player could walk out with lots of money from it without a deposit. I know everyone has some kind of requirement for players to be able to keep any money from a No Deposit Bonus. As I have plenty of experience at taking the No Deposit Bonus and playing through, then taking the returned portion and making a nice return from it.

The benefit of using a PTC is that when players don't or can't make a deposit through normal means. Then the PTC works out for both the Casino and the players. Instead of just giving them the money to play a PTC makes them earn it by visiting the Casinos. Casinos win because it gives them exposure for pennies and not hundreds in bonuses. Players win because once they get enough to make a withdrawal it is usually enough to make a deposit. And they have already seen the Casinos websites so they tend to go there first and deposit using that money they earned. It is up to the Casino if they offer bonuses with the Deposit. And best of all instead if listening for players constantly wanting Free Bonuses you can give them your link to CasinoClicks and ask them to use it to get the funding to deposit with.

How does a PTC work for Players?
CasinoClicks works with you the owners and casino affiliates to bring the advertising dollars in. Once you purchase the advertising packages we help you setup the advertising. By setting up the paid to view cost for each ad, setting up which type of ads you want, setting up banners, setting up where you want to advertise at. Second we will be offering you the opportunity to save on some of the Signup Bonuses and let you pay the user a portion up front to their account on CasinoClicks using the Paid-to Signup section. The Paid-to-Signup section will allow you to actually get new players by giving them cash or casino credits once they signup and deposit on the casino.

The Paid-to-Signup section will allow you to pay the user like $5 to their account on CasinoClciks once they have made a deposit and meet all your requirements for it. I don't set the rules on the Paid-to-Signup section as it is your Casino or Casino Affiliate account and up to you whatever you wish to pay the user for doing what you ask of them.

Give us a chance to prove that your advertising dollars will be spent on bring in new players or helping existing players to continue to play.

I am confident that you will like the way we do business that if your not Satisfied within 30 days of Purchase I will Refund your Money Back. No questions asked.

**BBCasinos** · 8 August 2016, 7:57 am

Check you logo on top of your post.
You have written "clciks" in it. Small mistake, but not very proffesional

**ardodd** · 8 August 2016, 8:37 am

Originally Posted by BBCasinos

Check you logo on top of your post.
You have written "clciks" in it. Small mistake, but not very proffesional

Thank you for Noticing the mistake. All corrected now.

**universal4** · 8 August 2016, 12:41 pm

#1 If you will be taking deposits by PayPal from US Residents, those US Residents may be jeopardizing their PP accounts for using their accounts to fund anything related to gambling. Whether it is ok based on the terms in your country does not automatically mean it is safe for US Residents as they still take a strong stance against it in the US.

#2 How will you be determining and then dealing with click fraud? With PTC programs it is not a question of if but more a question of when the fraud will start and how often it will take place.

Every single PTC program out there, especially those that allow gambling ads have proven that a degree of publishers will cheat and inflate clicks in order to raise their commission payouts. Many will even buy ads from the (pay to read) email groups and share a portion of the click rate to those who are paid to click, which is also fraudulent traffic.

#3 How many affiliate programs have you discussed the Paid to signup with? Paying a player to signup and deposit is clearly incetivised traffic and most affiliate programs have very specific terms agaisnt incentives to signup.

Rick
Universal4

**ardodd** · 8 August 2016, 3:17 pm

Originally Posted by universal4

#1 If you will be taking deposits by PayPal from US Residents, those US Residents may be jeopardizing their PP accounts for using their accounts to fund anything related to gambling. Whether it is ok based on the terms in your country does not automatically mean it is safe for US Residents as they still take a strong stance against it in the US.

#2 How will you be determining and then dealing with click fraud? With PTC programs it is not a question of if but more a question of when the fraud will start and how often it will take place.

Every single PTC program out there, especially those that allow gambling ads have proven that a degree of publishers will cheat and inflate clicks in order to raise their commission payouts. Many will even buy ads from the (pay to read) email groups and share a portion of the click rate to those who are paid to click, which is also fraudulent traffic.

#3 How many affiliate programs have you discussed the Paid to signup with? Paying a player to signup and deposit is clearly incetivised traffic and most affiliate programs have very specific terms agaisnt incentives to signup.

Rick
Universal4

Rick,

All of those are very good questions which i am aim to prove to some degree with the system security and who makes deposits.

I fully understand the rules laid out by GPWA to be a certified and credited website. So I will submit a full explanation in detailed form as soon as I can get all ready to submit. To answer your questions today I will give informal information about what measures I plan to take to make it secure.

Question #1 If you will be taking deposits by PayPal from US Residents, those US Residents may be jeopardizing their PP accounts for using their accounts to fund anything related to gambling. Whether it is ok based on the terms in your country does not automatically mean it is safe for US Residents as they still take a strong stance against it in the US.

Answer #1 I will not be accepting payments for gambling. What I will do accept payments for advertising only. What the enduser does with the money earned is not up to me. I will make every effort to allow a user to withdraw anyway they see fit. I will also encourage any user to withdraw using Bitcoins since most US Players can not deposit through US Banks with all the regulations regarding Internet Gambling. I do want to make sure everyone understands that I am only selling advertising packages for the casino and/or casino affiliate. And all that the user does is view casino websites and offers for money. Once they have reached a minimum level then they can withdraw.

Question #2 How will you be determining and then dealing with click fraud? With PTC programs it is not a question of if but more a question of when the fraud will start and how often it will take place.

Answer #2 In my admin panel I have 4 settings that work together for security purposes.
a) Blacklist: 1)I maintain a Blacklist of IP's that have or have tried to signup more than one person from that IP.
2)I blacklist any IP that has a different login than its IP country login. Meaning if they signup from US IP but login from Vietnam IP they are instantly blocked.
b) Cheat Log: A Cheat log is Maintained and any user that is caught cheating will be Banned for life.
c) Captcha: I maintain several ways of verifying that it is not bot.
1) Captcha is used on the Registration and Login Page.
2) Captcha is used through reCaptcha and customizable.
3) We have a secondary Captcha I am learning to program. It contains a Challenge Key, Verification Key, Authentication Hash Key.

Every single PTC program out there, especially those that allow gambling ads have proven that a degree of publishers will cheat and inflate clicks in order to raise their commission payouts. Many will even buy ads from the (pay to read) email groups and share a portion of the click rate to those who are paid to click, which is also fraudulent traffic.

As i am constantly worrying about bots and fraudulent traffic myself. That is one of the reasons i want to maintain a higher level of security. I have been working with some very impressive developers that have work with me to fix bugs in some of the captcha and how they work. We have identified some timing issues along with keyboard F5 back stroke issues. So i fully maintain and stay up to date on those developments.

The other development I will be using is a website link tracking. I find this helpful in seeing where the links are placed and if caught in anyone of those places you described they will be automatically Banned for life. This is my life work and i will not allow one bad apple to destroy all this work to be honest and fair to everyone.

Question #3 How many affiliate programs have you discussed the Paid to signup with? Paying a player to signup and deposit is clearly incetivised traffic and most affiliate programs have very specific terms agaisnt incentives to signup.

Answer #3 I have spoke to one person so far about the Paid-to-Signup program. And they reminded me that their offer to pay me or anyone that wants to signup someone for their casino has certain requirements that have to be meet.

Example: AB Affiliate wants to promote ABC Casino and gets paid $20 for each and up to 5 referrals per month.
Requirements are:
1)For every friend you refer who becomes a depositing, wagering player (minimum amount to deposit and wager is $50), you will receive a $20 Refer a Friend fee.
2)All Refer a Friend fees will be payable on the first working day of the following month.
3)Maximum Refer a Friend fees that can be earned per month will be dependent on your VIP Tier. Green and Red Bull players are allowed 5 referrals, Silver and Gold Bull players are allowed 8, and Diamond Bull players are allowed 15. New Players (players without a VIP status) are allowed 5 referrals.
4)Earnings/Fees will be credited directly to your (The Referer’s) gaming account where it can either be cashed in, or wagered, allowing the Referer to possibly increase the earnings.
5)The maximum amount that can be withdrawn is 5X the earned amount. Example: you have earned $100, you’ve played and increased your balance, and can now withdraw a maximum of $500.
6)Players with a ‘New Player’ status are not allowed to double their earnings; and will only be allowed to cashout their default earnings.
7)Minimum earnings that can be withdrawn are $100.

Default withdrawal pending period will apply.
9)The casino reserves the right to withhold/deny Refer a Friend earnings if abusive/fraudulent behaviour is suspected, i.e., multiple linked accounts, fictitious registrations, etc.

So if anyone wants to use a Paid-to-Signup Offer they will have to show proof that is Approved by the Casino Owner or is Listed by the Casino Owner or one of its Executives. Meaning that the Paid-To-Signup Section is for Casino owners and their Offers. No Affiliate Offers Allowed.

I will be more than happy to have all this in writing and posted along with submission of credentials and TOS and Privacy ACT pages submitted before i go any further.

**universal4** · 8 August 2016, 4:23 pm

#1 Just the fact that you are planning to accept deposits that are RELATED to gambling, as well as a gambling domain automatically places the person in the United States in jeopardy of having issues with their PP account.

There are a number of affiliates that can tell stories of PP closing accounts for being used in connection with others concerning gambling domains, links etc that did not have anything to do with actual gambling. (You will be accepting payments for connections to gambling related activities)

#2 Bots are only a portion of the click fraud.
It is good to know that you have already taken multiple use of the same ip into consideration concerning fraud, but those that would purchase paid clicks do so in order to circumvent this.

The pay-to-click people actually pay people to perform the captcha and click so just having the captcha alone is not enough.

Multiple signups have nothing to do really with visitor click fraud. There is a long history that Pay-to-click advertisers have been dealing with click fraud, and it goes back many years even to the days of "Find What and 7 Search" as well as others. Google actually sees a little bit of it, although they do a much better job with cookies etc....(although I have heard stories where their links are part of the email stuff although policed a little better)

So if I have a link that I will earn $5 per click from and I pay one of the pay to read and click email mailers for 1000 for, how do you plan on determining and stopping that? The email readers and clickers will have ip addresses from all over the world, they will be unique as they only get paid for unique emails and unique clicks, and of course it is not valid traffic in any way, but it will appear to be valid unique traffic.

#3 Any casino that takes the paid-to-signup traffic and has anything in their terms about not allowing incentivised traffic would be breaking their own terms. Whether affiliates actually get away with this is a different story, but most programs have the term since most have found over the years that anyone that is "paid" to sign up is not very high quality.

Not sure why quoting refer-a-friend terms would be quoted, but I would think affiliates would not be using your service for such referrals.

Rick
Universal4

Edited to add:
I do not recall if you stated other ways people can make deposits, since most would not be able to use a credit card unless you have an actual merchant account that is NOT connected to the gambling domain, since Visa and Mastercard would have a problem with it.

**ardodd** · 8 August 2016, 6:14 pm

Originally Posted by universal4

#1 Just the fact that you are planning to accept deposits that are RELATED to gambling, as well as a gambling domain automatically places the person in the United States in jeopardy of having issues with their PP account.

There are a number of affiliates that can tell stories of PP closing accounts for being used in connection with others concerning gambling domains, links etc that did not have anything to do with actual gambling. (You will be accepting payments for connections to gambling related activities)

#2 Bots are only a portion of the click fraud.
It is good to know that you have already taken multiple use of the same ip into consideration concerning fraud, but those that would purchase paid clicks do so in order to circumvent this.

The pay-to-click people actually pay people to perform the captcha and click so just having the captcha alone is not enough.

Multiple signups have nothing to do really with visitor click fraud. There is a long history that Pay-to-click advertisers have been dealing with click fraud, and it goes back many years even to the days of "Find What and 7 Search" as well as others. Google actually sees a little bit of it, although they do a much better job with cookies etc....(although I have heard stories where their links are part of the email stuff although policed a little better)

So if I have a link that I will earn $5 per click from and I pay one of the pay to read and click email mailers for 1000 for, how do you plan on determining and stopping that? The email readers and clickers will have ip addresses from all over the world, they will be unique as they only get paid for unique emails and unique clicks, and of course it is not valid traffic in any way, but it will appear to be valid unique traffic.

#3 Any casino that takes the paid-to-signup traffic and has anything in their terms about not allowing incentivised traffic would be breaking their own terms. Whether affiliates actually get away with this is a different story, but most programs have the term since most have found over the years that anyone that is "paid" to sign up is not very high quality.

Not sure why quoting refer-a-friend terms would be quoted, but I would think affiliates would not be using your service for such referrals.

Rick
Universal4

Edited to add:
I do not recall if you stated other ways people can make deposits, since most would not be able to use a credit card unless you have an actual merchant account that is NOT connected to the gambling domain, since Visa and Mastercard would have a problem with it.

Rick to address what questions you posted.

Question #1 Just the fact that you are planning to accept deposits that are RELATED to gambling, as well as a gambling domain automatically places the person in the United States in jeopardy of having issues with their PP account.

There are a number of affiliates that can tell stories of PP closing accounts for being used in connection with others concerning gambling domains, links etc that did not have anything to do with actual gambling. (You will be accepting payments for connections to gambling related activities)

I have read the Policies that Paypal has issued in its newest updates which they posted on July 15,2015 and can reviewed here Paypal Policies and Request for Review. I have already sent a email to [email protected] asking for a review of my website and asking if it is in Compliance according to Paypal Policies. At anytime I can turn off the deposit method and same for withdrawal. I requested a Review of my website and for Clarification whether I can accept and allow withdrawal or if I can only use the withdrawal. As I don't want to put anyone in jeopardy of losing anything and will let Paypal decide if it is acceptable under their Policies.

Question #2 Bots are only a portion of the click fraud.
It is good to know that you have already taken multiple use of the same ip into consideration concerning fraud, but those that would purchase paid clicks do so in order to circumvent this.

The pay-to-click people actually pay people to perform the captcha and click so just having the captcha alone is not enough.

So if I have a link that I will earn $5 per click from and I pay one of the pay to read and click email mailers for 1000 for, how do you plan on determining and stopping that? The email readers and clickers will have ip addresses from all over the world, they will be unique as they only get paid for unique emails and unique clicks, and of course it is not valid traffic in any way, but it will appear to be valid unique traffic.

Answer #3 This not your normal Paid-to-Click website as it is focused only on Casinos. And with the normal PTC Clubs this will not benefit them at all. As I am trying to find out if I can get Approval for a Players Reward Card Program just for this website. I really want to keep the money users earn within the Casino Community. I can allow players to withdraw using Bitcoins so they can play by being able to deposit using the Bitcoins. Secondly I am not going to reward users $5 per click for anything, as that much is a sure sign of Scam. I am trying to help users (Casino Players) be able to earn enough to use the earnings for a deposit on any Casino. This not by any means a way for people get free money. That is the more important to be able to restrict how people withdraw, and using a Players Reward Card to withdraw on means it can only be redeemed in a Casino, not just anywhere. If the normal PTC person come to my website and found out they can just cashout and could only use the earnings to play or gamble with it would not be worth their time.

Question #2 Any casino that takes the paid-to-signup traffic and has anything in their terms about not allowing incentivised traffic would be breaking their own terms. Whether affiliates actually get away with this is a different story, but most programs have the term since most have found over the years that anyone that is "paid" to sign up is not very high quality.

Not sure why quoting refer-a-friend terms would be quoted, but I would think affiliates would not be using your service for such referrals.

Answer #3 The Paid-to-Signup is only a way for Casino Owners to place their Signup Bonuses at. It is not referring to being paid for signing up by my website. It is only for Casino Owners to place their website bonuses or offers at.

The reason I included the Refer-a-Friend program was to explain that even if someone did put their signup program in the Paid-to-Signup section they would still have to comply with that casinos TOS and Conditions.

I am for no reason trying to take advantage of anyone for any reason. I have the best of intentions and only want to do what is right for any casino. If it not what anyone would use or recommend then I have no problem withdrawing this thread and not mentioning it again. If anyone feels that I am not trying to fair and honest then i will withdraw from it and remove all links related to it.

**universal4** · 8 August 2016, 11:28 pm

Depending on the COUNTRY YOU are in is different if you are not in the US.

If in fact you are in the US, my guess is they will decline even allowing the PP name or logo anywhere on the site. I may end up being surprised by their response, but I do NOT think they have changed their position in the UNITED STATES and in fact have made recent announcements concerning the use of PP on DFS and other fantasy sites because of the ties to gambling.

There are plenty of sites in other countries that have PP blessings to take deposits and payouts, but if a US Resident tries to use it in connection with a gambling site, or gets caught using it to buy or sell links for a gambling site, and anything with any kind of connection to gambling, the COULD lose immediate access to their account and funds.

You say that this is not a normal PTC, but if there are links that affiliates earn from, then there will be fraud. That is the nature of commissions concerning these kinds of things. Like I said before it is good you have thought about portions of it, but I do not think you have look into it deeply enough.

Those paying for the ads will CERTAINLY let you know when they study the traffic.

I never thought you were personally trying to take advantage of anyone and I NEVER said that nor have I tried to imply it.

Instead of just giving them the money to play a PTC makes them earn it by visiting the Casinos.

In the end, I can not see why a casino would want traffic that is being paid in any way, they want gamblers, willing to spend their own money not someone visiting the property based upon ANY incentive they will pocket, whether pennies or not.

Rick
Universal4

**ardodd** · 8 August 2016, 11:58 pm

Originally Posted by universal4

Depending on the COUNTRY YOU are in is different if you are not in the US.

If in fact you are in the US, my guess is they will decline even allowing the PP name or logo anywhere on the site. I may end up being surprised by their response, but I do NOT think they have changed their position in the UNITED STATES and in fact have made recent announcements concerning the use of PP on DFS and other fantasy sites because of the ties to gambling.

There are plenty of sites in other countries that have PP blessings to take deposits and payouts, but if a US Resident tries to use it in connection with a gambling site, or gets caught using it to buy or sell links for a gambling site, and anything with any kind of connection to gambling, the COULD lose immediate access to their account and funds.

You say that this is not a normal PTC, but if there are links that affiliates earn from, then there will be fraud. That is the nature of commissions concerning these kinds of things. Like I said before it is good you have thought about portions of it, but I do not think you have look into it deeply enough.

Those paying for the ads will CERTAINLY let you know when they study the traffic.

I never thought you were personally trying to take advantage of anyone and I NEVER said that nor have I tried to imply it.

In the end, I can not see why a casino would want traffic that is being paid in any way, they want gamblers, willing to spend their own money not someone visiting the property based upon ANY incentive they will pocket, whether pennies or not.

Rick
Universal4

Thank you Rick,

And yes you have been honest with me on everything that has to do with Casinos and with GPWA since I joined. And I knew when I posted this thread I would get a fair and honest review and recommendations from your point of view. I respect your questions and answers to my responses.

That is why I said I would like to post a thread about it and see what recommendations and/or comments and suggestions that other casino owners and affiliates would have concerning this.

Yes PTC's have a horrible track record when it comes to being honest. And yes like you said there are crowds of PTC users that are setting there waiting for the next one to open so they rush in take the money and run.

And you are 100% correct that any casino that would entertain my idea of running a fair PTC would only be clouded by doubt. That they if anyone ever did use my site to advertise there would be doubt in whether the traffic was real or not. And yes you are 100% correct in that all traffic would need to be tracked and verified for authenticity.

So I am going to withdraw my thread and remove the links associated to it. And ask that this thread be removed from GPWA.

Thank you for your Honesty and Recommendations.....

Albert

**universal4** · 9 August 2016, 12:07 am

Actually, some of the PTC and other ad groups were doing everything they could to stay honest, it was their affiliates that often perpetrated the majority of the fraud and caused the ad agencies all the issues, chargebacks, upset advertisers paying for the fraud traffic etc etc etc...

Rick
Universal4

**universal4** · 9 August 2016, 12:20 am

By the way this is the term that PayPal uses to close account of US Residents when their accounts are connected (in any way) to gambling, gambling sites, and gambling domains.

PayPal prohibits transactions for gambling activities by merchants and account holders in the U.S. and any jurisdiction where gambling activities are illegal, and by merchants whose services are accessible to account holders in the U.S.

https://www.paypal.com/selfhelp/article/FAQ915

So even if you end up being an approved merchant, PP can still use this term against any US Resident to close their accounts when they use PayPal to purchase "services" from any kind of gambling merchant.

I am guessing that possibly one of the biggest stumbling blocks you may face in order to become an approved merchant, is if you accept US Traffic they "may" say that you are not taking steps to limit gambling activities to US residents.

To be approved by PayPal, merchants must demonstrate to PayPal's satisfaction that they have the ability to block gambling activities for account holders in the U.S. and any jurisdiction where gambling activities may be illegal.

Even though you will not have gambling activities on your site, since your "service" links visitors directly to said gambling activities, my assumption is this is likely the rule that will work against your approval.

Also, it seems you are trying to get approval from the wrong place

Merchants seeking approval to conduct gambling activities in accordance with this policy may send contact information and a brief summary of their business to [email protected].

Rick
Universal4

**ardodd** · 9 August 2016, 1:09 am

I want to keep my business open and honest and this is the reply that PP give when I asked for a Review of my site.

Once I received that email I instantly turned off the PP Gateway and will not accept nor allow withdrawals using PP from my website. The only Payment Processors I have available at this time is through SolidTrustPay, Payza, Bitcoin to be used as deposit or withdrawal purposes.

And the one thing i said before is that I am trying to find out if I can use a Players Rewards Card Program and only allow withdrawals to it. That way the usual PTC'ers are discouraged from joining since they can not take the money and run.

I am open to suggestions on making it work for the better of the Casinos and players. I am entertaining the thought of only rewarding users with Coupons to the Casinos that participate. Entertaining the thought that if I can workout a way to only use coupons as a means for rewarding the player and that if they use the coupon code I am given and they use it according to the Casinos requirements. And I meet all requirements set forth by the Casino, that i can use a portion of the coupon proceeds to keep up the website maintenance and hosting fee's.

I would be responsible for the players meeting the requirements and the authenticity of each users. As which they can not use the coupon code unless they have a account on that Casino. This takes the burden away from purchasing advertising and leaves me with the burden of proof that the players are legitimate and using the coupon towards Casino Play. And I would be subject to only getting portion of that twice a month or even once a month. If they do not turn into players during any calendar month and fail to meet the playing requirements I am not eligible for any compensation at all.

But still open to Suggestions....?????

**universal4** · 9 August 2016, 2:18 pm

The best way to drive good traffic to the casinos is NOT to offer an incentive to click or join.

People that get paid to click are interested in clicking and getting paid, not looking for places to gamble.

Affiliates can help drive the traffic (since THEY want to get paid for the clicks) but you will have to determine how to stop the fraud.

By offering players an incentive to get paid to join, they will try to work out how they can get clicks they get paid for (essentially turning them into affiliates) and they are not looking for players that join, deposit and earn netwin, just for ways to get clickers that they can get paid for.

If you can find that balance, advertisers will renew ads.

Rick
Universal4

The response from PP was interesting, but it might be a good thing you did not actually provided them the name of the site in connection with your account as that might have caused further problems for you.

**TheGooner** · 9 August 2016, 4:28 pm

Originally Posted by universal4

The best way to drive good traffic to the casinos is NOT to offer an incentive to click or join.
People that get paid to click are interested in clicking and getting paid, not looking for places to gamble.

This pretty much sums up my thinking ...

While you are providing traffic to casinos - the fact that they are ONLY clicking because they'll earn some money (somehow) - and that they are not looking to deposit their own money - means that this stream "self-selects" low value players ...

I can't see the value proposition in this for casinos / affiliate porgrams

**ardodd** · 10 August 2016, 3:15 am

Thank you all for your Respectful suggestions.

I am feeling well, nor am I doing well with my health. Spent all day yesterday having test run, getting treatment, and fighting for my life. We can't get the blood sugar below 450 and fighting infection after infection. I did not get home til 9:00 pm last night.Tried to get a little rest aand can't sleep again.

I am just dropping this whole thing closing down the website and walking away from it all. Nothing makes any sense right now, becoming very confused repeatedly. Just enough time left in live to let this things bother me.

Happy Gambling and May al your Spins be Jackpots !!!!!!

**universal4** · 10 August 2016, 3:33 pm

Really sorry to hear about the health issues.

If I could I would take 50 points from you, (would keep me closer to normal...lol) I have a buddy that swings into that range on occasion but his normal range is in the 200's.

Rick
Universal4

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